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Deletion of lighted vanity mirrors and rear led reading lights

Deletion of lighted vanity mirrors and rear led reading lights

We have received our time to build email and we were very excited about finally doing so until we read the report about there being no vanity mirrors with lights in a car which was going to cost us over $109000(before rebate) and was touted as the world's best "Premium"/Luxury car. It was the last straw for my wife. She was ready to put up with the lack of cup holders in back, cheap console etc. but no vanity mirrors with lights did it. Now she wants me to cancel and get an ICE car like a MBZ, BMW or Jag etc. What a shame! I really enjoyed the handling and performance but they are removing features which are standard or optional in $20K cars. It just so happens that my wife is senior exec with an international news wire and knows a lot of columnists and media people. She had been excitedly telling them about our new car but now you can imagine reading articles with headings like "Tesla customers canceling orders over no vanity mirrors and cup holders in rear" or 'Tesla makes a great car for the extinct Spartans" etc. etc.

We are not the only ones irate over this. There are a lot of upset people over at The Tesla Motors Club site -http://www.teslamotorsclub.com/showthread.php/9490-Interior-lighting-Cha... .

I wonder who made This "brilliant" decision at Tesla motors.

rd2 | August 1, 2012

I don't really care that the vanity lights and rear passenger reading lights are not going to be there - it won't affect me at all. However, I can tell you that my wife will not be happy about the lack of these pretty basic creature comforts. Especially since these are cheap, easy to install items. It really is perplexing that they are removing them.

Ultimately, most of us are not buying the car only for ourselves. It's a family-sized sedan, and families are bound to have different needs, interests, likes/dislikes than individuals. With that in mind, I really don't understand why Tesla is actually taking options AWAY at this point. I was ok with the cupholders and console thing, as they are now trying to give us options. But to take away options that most consider standard, it just leaves a bad taste on the experience.

I am still all-in, but I can already see that people in the same buying category are going to be turned off - and probably a lot of people - if they're trying to steal folks away from BMW and Merc. You have to at least be competitive on the interior, regardless of the wonderful technology inside the car.

It is analogous to what TM said about the exterior: elegant, beautiful, but still somewhat conservative. Why? Because they don't want to make it too extreme for the general populace, and so it will be easier to adopt. Well, by taking away the basic features of the interior for the 'general populace', TM is now making the interior 'too extreme' a change from what most people would expect cars in this price range to have. It's not that complicated. Put the lights back in.

R

p4157

ScottM | August 1, 2012

Reading the comments above, seems like a glass half full or empty scenario. You can either view the Model S as an imperfect luxury car, or the most awesome/fun electric car ever built. I'm in the latter category and am willing to cut Tesla some slack for two reasons:

1) These guys are running a start-up with a huge burn rate and need to get some revenue to survive (and then hopefully thrive). They probably made the rational choice of getting something pretty good to market soon, rather than getting something perfect to market too late. I'd do the same thing.

2) My experience as a Roadster owner has been excellent. Tesla has had friendly, excellent service. They've fixed/upgraded some things on my 1.5 Roadster that weren't initially promised me, and at no cost to me. I think they really care about their customers; more so than the luxury brand I drive today.

nvjx | August 1, 2012

Steve_W and rd2 I totally agree with you. By the way I did not start this thread because I have a hidden agenda against TM. Contrary to some rude posters like Timo accusing me "of shorting the Tesla stock" I have never even owned any stock of any kind in my life. We have our money invested in conservative GOs and other Govt. backed bonds and have done well enough to pay cash for everything including our house and cars etc. By the way Timo I did well enough to retire at the age of 50 so my wife doesn't need to hire me as her driver(as you rudely suggested) but if you are hard up and worried about the Stock Market she would consider you for the job.

Anyway, I admire Elon Musk and what he has achieved at such a young age with SpaceX, Tesla and the Solar Co. He reminds me of late Steve Jobs. We reserved our model S three years ago after seeing the first prototype. My wife and I have always been excited about "Green" technology. We have had a 5.2 kw solar system on our roof for years, we bought the original Prius years ago and now have a 2012 Prius along with a BMW and a MBZ roadster. We also owned a Volt for a while but sold it recently in anticipation of getting the Model S.
We want Tesla to succeed. That is why we are spending over $109000 before rebate on this car which is not chump change. We received our "time to build email" last week and were very excited but over the weekend read the shocking report on another thread in the Tesla forum about deletion of vanity and rear lights. Considering the price of this car, and Mr Musk's statement of building the best premium/luxury car in the world, this was shocking to us. The car is already missing basic elements in the interior of most cars - like the rear arm rest, rear cup holders etc but this seemed like the last straw. I am not the only one upset over this latest deletion of lighted vanity mirrors. There are over 16 pages of customers discussing this topic on the Tesla Motors Club thread (which by the way I did not start)

TM has to realize that the very same reviewers who were initially impressed by the handling and performance of Model S in their short test drives will comment about the basic missing elements of the car's interior when they have more time to examine the vehicle. Secondly, when the initial euphoria of owning a brand new performance EV dies down people and their wives, friends, relatives etc will start noticing the lack of some basic features in the car and the word will get around. Not many discerning folks will want to spend their hard earned dollars on a car lacking features which are standard on basic cars. Lastly, men are not going to be the only drivers of this car. Women, including my wife, drive all different models and types of cars. So, unless this car was designed and reserved to be for "Men Only" TM needs to take into consideration some basic needs of women in an automobile like lighted vanity mirrors which all the other manufacturers cars have available for them.

So, I think it is very important that the higher up decision makers at TM take more notice of this before it is too late and the "final" product hits the road or some irate customer sends out a press release over a national news wire about why he/she decided against buying the Model S after waiting for years.

Vall | August 1, 2012

When tesla runs out of people who don't care about vanity mirrors and rear seat lighting, maybe they will do something about it. As it is, they have a huge amount of orders to fill, so I can see why this is a non-issue for them. They removed those items for a reason and should stick to it, if they cave in to consumer demands, model S will end up with 12 mega-gulp sized cup holders, and rear lights into which people bump their heads all the time. Yeah, the roofline seems pretty steep at the back. A folding mirror with LEDs built-in sitting in the glove compartment or the wife's purse (next to the make-up) will do the exact same job anyway.

So tough for tesla for letting customers go, and tough for the customers for not getting a unique and awesome car. Apple had the same problem from day one, people demanded microSD slots, then said they will walk backwards until apple gives them Flash, millions supposedly left apple for the huge screens of android phones. And yet apple is dong fine, because there are always people that don't really care about stuff like that.

Mel. | August 1, 2012

Vall , well said.

BYT | August 1, 2012

FYI: http://www.teslamotorsclub.com/showthread.php/9545-Official-word-from-Te...(GeorgeB)-on-the-vanity-mirror-light-and-rear-reading-lights?p=169977#post169977

BYT | August 1, 2012

All is good and right in the world of Model S once again!!

brianman | August 1, 2012

@jerry
[[For what it's worth, Tesla has never said "luxury". They have said "premium".]]

On the website, that's correct.

In interviews and for Amped drives, they've said "luxury" a few times. Usually it's followed 1 to 2 sentences later with a correction to "premium". But "luxury" has been said.

stephen.kamichik | August 1, 2012

According to Stephen Smith of TM....There will still be vanity mirrors under the sun visors regardless of whether there are lights or not.

KevinR.co.us | August 1, 2012

BYT- Thanks for the link from TMC (& thanks to GeorgeB for the post)... now we can get back to the cupholders :o)

Larry Chanin | August 1, 2012

As Ben has pointed out George Blankenship has stated, contrary to the title of this thread, that there will be a lighted vanity mirror and rear reading lights.

For those who have not followed Ben's link, here's a quote from his posting on the TMC forum:

Hi everyone,

First of all, thanks to everyone throughout this thread who had faith in us that we were doing the right thing. Your support is always greatly appreciated.

So, what’s going on… This thread started as the result of a change to our website specs page and a response from one of the Tesla Team about rear seat reading lights and the desire to increase visibility for tall customers. The following highlights exactly what we’ve been working on.

The beta Lighted Vanity Visor that first showed up in Model S was not acceptable to us from an appearance, function or size standpoint. So we rejected it and immediately started working on another version. In the meantime, we started delivering cars. We did not want to be delivering cars without Lighted Vanity Visors when our webpage specs said otherwise…so we changed the specs page to be more accurate at that moment in time.

The removal of 2nd Row Reading lights from the specs page is also an “accuracy of the moment” issue. We removed these from the specs page because we were working on another initiative that might impact what type of light we could use in the back seat for a reading light. Basically, we found a way to potentially add a few millimeters of additional headroom in the back seat. As part of that initiative, we didn’t know for sure if we would be able to use the same light fixture, or even the same type of reading light going forward…so we deleted it from the specs page to be more accurate at the time.

Both of these issues are temporary issues, and for those of you who have been following us for a while, you know how we operate. When something doesn’t meet our expectations, we dive right in to fix it. We work hard to find the best solution possible, then we implement it. We try to keep all information as up to date as possible, but in today’s world, that sometimes causes problems from a communication standpoint. Nevertheless, we always feel as though it is better to be as accurate and up to date as possible, even if it makes things a little tougher for us from time to time.

You will soon see another change to our specs page. You will see the addition of 2nd Row Reading Lights. We have been able to accomplish what we set out to do with the rear seat headroom, and will be able provide reading lights in the same place as originally planned. We focused first on the headroom adjustment because that is more complicated within the car itself, then we focused on the lights and placement. To avoid any further questions about what will happen next, let me be perfectly clear... there will be a few early cars delivered that do not have 2nd Row Reading Lights. However, we will be happy to install them in the future (at no charge of course). The wires are already in place so this is not a major event.

You will not see the Lighted Vanity Visor back on the specs page for a little while longer because we are still working on getting the form factor and functionality exactly the way we want it. It will be lighted, it will have a mirror, and it can easily be retrofit into all cars. In fact, we will be encouraging everyone to get the retrofit.

So just to be clear, all cars that get delivered are set up to have reading lights in 2nd row seats and Lighted Vanity Visors. Those that don’t have the latest and greatest when they receive their car can have these items retrofit at no additional cost.

I hope this helps clear up all questions regarding this issue. Please understand, we are very, very serious about everything that goes into Model S. We are doing all we can to make every millimeter count while still listening to what our customers and future customers want. We are going to have lights in the right places, a shelf that was asked for by customers in the console area, and a lighted visor mirror that you can look into and smile. And when all is said and done, that is what we are really striving for…you smiling.

GeorgeB

Larry

Kariwood | August 1, 2012

Amazing company!

Sudre_ | August 1, 2012

Now for the post about how someone canceled their SIG because of the lack of some small interior item missing on the spec page which is now included...lol

All these posts and they intended to include it all along.

James13 | August 1, 2012

Originally Posted by GeorgeB
Hi everyone,

First of all, thanks to everyone throughout this thread who had faith in us that we were doing the right thing. Your support is always greatly appreciated.

So, what’s going on… This thread started as the result of a change to our website specs page and a response from one of the Tesla Team about rear seat reading lights and the desire to increase visibility for tall customers. The following highlights exactly what we’ve been working on.

The beta Lighted Vanity Visor that first showed up in Model S was not acceptable to us from an appearance, function or size standpoint. So we rejected it and immediately started working on another version. In the meantime, we started delivering cars. We did not want to be delivering cars without Lighted Vanity Visors when our webpage specs said otherwise…so we changed the specs page to be more accurate at that moment in time.

The removal of 2nd Row Reading lights from the specs page is also an “accuracy of the moment” issue. We removed these from the specs page because we were working on another initiative that might impact what type of light we could use in the back seat for a reading light. Basically, we found a way to potentially add a few millimeters of additional headroom in the back seat. As part of that initiative, we didn’t know for sure if we would be able to use the same light fixture, or even the same type of reading light going forward…so we deleted it from the specs page to be more accurate at the time.

Both of these issues are temporary issues, and for those of you who have been following us for a while, you know how we operate. When something doesn’t meet our expectations, we dive right in to fix it. We work hard to find the best solution possible, then we implement it. We try to keep all information as up to date as possible, but in today’s world, that sometimes causes problems from a communication standpoint. Nevertheless, we always feel as though it is better to be as accurate and up to date as possible, even if it makes things a little tougher for us from time to time.

You will soon see another change to our specs page. You will see the addition of 2nd Row Reading Lights. We have been able to accomplish what we set out to do with the rear seat headroom, and will be able provide reading lights in the same place as originally planned. We focused first on the headroom adjustment because that is more complicated within the car itself, then we focused on the lights and placement. To avoid any further questions about what will happen next, let me be perfectly clear... there will be a few early cars delivered that do not have 2nd Row Reading Lights. However, we will be happy to install them in the future (at no charge of course). The wires are already in place so this is not a major event.

You will not see the Lighted Vanity Visor back on the specs page for a little while longer because we are still working on getting the form factor and functionality exactly the way we want it. It will be lighted, it will have a mirror, and it can easily be retrofit into all cars. In fact, we will be encouraging everyone to get the retrofit.

So just to be clear, all cars that get delivered are set up to have reading lights in 2nd row seats and Lighted Vanity Visors. Those that don’t have the latest and greatest when they receive their car can have these items retrofit at no additional cost.

I hope this helps clear up all questions regarding this issue. Please understand, we are very, very serious about everything that goes into Model S. We are doing all we can to make every millimeter count while still listening to what our customers and future customers want. We are going to have lights in the right places, a shelf that was asked for by customers in the console area, and a lighted visor mirror that you can look into and smile. And when all is said and done, that is what we are really striving for…you smiling.

GeorgeB

Brian H | August 2, 2012

Oops!
polera257, pbrulott, nvjx and Steve_W may now have to un-cancel? Let us know how that goes, 'kay?

alexandre.cesar | August 2, 2012

Not sure if they just forgot to update but the Canadian wepage still shows the vanity lights and the reading lights as a standard feature.

http://www.teslamotors.com/en_CA/models/specs

Timo | August 2, 2012

It probably will be standard when Canadian deliveries begin (I think they are currently delivering only US cars).

pbrulott | August 2, 2012

@ Brian H,

read carefully, I said I'll wait fro my turn and see as I couldn't believe this was happening for real. for the others, I hope they didn't commit the irreparable.

anyway I have P179 Canada so I alway had the otpion from what I understand... ;-)

We can close this post. thank god

nvjx | August 2, 2012

Brian H | AUGUST 2, 2012
Oops!
polera257, pbrulott, nvjx and Steve_W may now have to un-cancel? Let us know how that goes, 'kay?

What a wonderful great response from George B and TM. This is what sets Tesla apart from other automobile manufacturers. This is what sets Elon Musk apart from the CEOs of other companies. My wife and I are grateful that TM responded to our and other customers concerns so promptly. We were devastated that we would have to cancel after waiting all these years. Well, we are confirming our "Build your Tesla email" today and now we can hardly wait to get the car. Personally I don't see any shortcomings in the car now. There will always be some features which can be added later.

For future reference, if there had been a better line of communication from TM regarding these features I and and others like me wouldn't have been venting our frustrations over these issues on this and the other forums. But hey, that is in the past as GeorgeB put it, we have a Tesla smile on our faces today!

It is time to delete this tread which I started.

Crow | August 2, 2012

@nvjx,
It's George's fault that you jumped to a false conclusion? It also could have been prevented by being patient and waiting for facts.

stevenmaifert | August 2, 2012

The rear LED reading lights have been added back to the specs page.

Tiebreaker | August 2, 2012

Lotsa people eating crow lately.

Show me another car manufacturer that gives sooo much information on unfinished vehicles.

Of course is George B's fault: he babies the babies so much, the babies impatiently cry for the smallest thing.

Baaaaaaa!!!! I want my HUGE chromed exhaust pipes!!!! BMW has them!!!

Sudre_ | August 2, 2012

I think some of the comments are cute. When I read these topics I try to imagine baby birds squawking for food from mom. Honestly I think I would be doing the same at this investment level if they appeared to be removing the supercharger access for the 60kw battery. I think some ppl just don't quite get Elon or Tesla so they panic easy.

Volker.Berlin | August 6, 2012

"You will soon see the addition of Second Row Reading Lights back on our Specs page. We have been able to accomplish what we set out to do with the rear seat headroom, and will be able to provide reading lights in the same place as originally planned. [...]

You will not see the Lighted Vanity Mirrors back on the Specs page for a little while longer because we are still working on getting the form factor and functionality exactly the way we want. It will be lighted, it will have a mirror, and it can easily be retrofit into all cars. In fact, we will be encouraging everyone to get the retrofit.

So just to be clear, all cars that get delivered are set up to have reading lights in second row seats and Lighted Vanity Mirrors. Those that don't have the latest and greatest when they receive their car can have these items easily retrofitted at no additional cost."
http://www.teslamotors.com/blog/inside-tesla-080212

nvjx | August 9, 2012

Crow | AUGUST 2, 2012
@nvjx,
It's George's fault that you jumped to a false conclusion? It also could have been prevented by being patient and waiting for facts.

Crow, If you read my previous posts on this and TM Club forums you will realize that I and others had received our 'Time To Build' emails so we were pressed for time to either cancel or defer. Some had already signed the paperwork before the changes in features happened so they were also very upset. Maybe you should read the thread on TM Club forum and see how many pages there are of people upset about all this. There was no false conclusion to jump to. There was no way for us to foresee that TM was planning on putting the features back in at a later date unless we had a crystal ball like you do. Anyway, I wouldn't eat a crow (pun intended).

As I stated in my previous post praising TM, let us move on with a Tesla grin because now all is well in the land of Tesla. End of conversation.

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